debate

it techly doesn't it just that locus it just that locus won't attack them, plus you can get more resources out of animals rather than planets such as glue, leather that actually has some durability to it, you can use the bones as chew toys for dogs, or you can carve them into instraments like native maericans, use the bones as decoration, or even use them for soop stock

my point is that these problems will persist even if we also farm animals the issue is that wer continuing the kill the earth as well as our crops being at risk so ultimately farming meat doesnt save the crops and meat itself does not have any nutrients that could supplement the nutrients that type of plant could give so wer fucked either way unless we give up animal agriculture to help the environment atleast

meat contains Vitamin B12, Creatine, Carnosine, Vitamin D3, Docosahexaenoic acid, Heme iron, and Taurine. you can't get those from plants and these are vital. if you need to know what they are search it up

yes you can get these from vegan sources, most vegan food is supplemented with B12 as well as D3 heme iron is linked to health problems "Men in the highest, compared with the lowest, quintile of heme iron intake had a 17% higher risk of total stroke (95% CI, 3%–32%) and a 15% higher risk of cerebral infarction (95% CI, 0%–33%).Jan 10, 2013" so your pivoting now to health?

so are you pivoting to health? and you need a balance of everything iron deficiency is higher in carnists than it is in vegans, and you can get vegan sources of iron id like to continue the debate on environment unless you concede that veganism is better for the environment, otherwise i want to stick with it

Heyaa, sorry to butt in, but I was reading through the debate and was pretty interested in it as I can relate to both sides of the story, hence why I'm awful at debating coz I just plant myself right on the fence xD But, I saw your points on fish and pain and stuff and thought I'd throw my 2 cents in there :P (Gonna preface this by saying, despite studying neuroscience at uni I am by no means an expert, and there's probably a billion people who know a tonne more than I do and in a tonne more depth, but I hope to think I have a grasp of the fundamentals lol) So from a sciencey point of view - The notion of fish in particular feeling pain, is sadly something we don't actually know yet. Pain, as we experience it, is an emotional state combined with all the complicated chemistry that goes on in the brain. And, as it currently stands, all we know is that fish have a much less complex brain, and a much less extensive neural network/nervous system, but that's not to say they don't feel pain. It just suggests that they feel pain to a lesser extent, or call it, a different kind of pain - probably makes more sense to think of it as a an evolutionary response to danger. So that kinda means we have no idea if fish feel pain as we associate it, or if it's more of just an evolutionary signal to get away without any of the emotional impacts that we typically associate with it. But that's part of the reason why neuroscience is such a popular branch of science atm, coz there's a tonne we still don't know :D I dunno if that cleared anyting up but yeah xD Also - as far as I'm aware, you can have a balanced vegan diet without a need for supplements (might mean you need to eat a bit more in quantity though lol), but it's very much possible.