debate

i mean yeah it was being hyperbolic but i feel like you can assume i know about taxes xD neither of us brought up sales tax, but you can assume we both understand that also is involved in the transactions

im up for any vegan debates on the grounds of ethics just name the trait that animals lack that allows you to remove their moral consideration

@Lamby animals get different moral rights because the don't understand the idea of morals. We do the same thing to mentally ill people, you can't give rights to something that simply doesn't understand the concept, a wolf isn't going to not attack you because you didn't attack first there for it's not self defense. You can't just tack HUMAN morals, morals that were breed into us to prosper in a civilized world, to animals that only understand 1 thing, survival of the fittest. Animals also don't feel remorse, or preemptive guilt, making it kinda hard for them to go oh this is going to make people angry at me.

@atmousfear oh do you want to to debate? I'm not looking for critiques on veganism unless we're having a proper debate, and even then I'm only really interested in ethics "We do the same thing to mentally ill people" No we don't. Are mentally ill people often times given less moral consideration than the general population? Yes. But we do not farm them for food or kill them because they are a nuisance and/or a drain on our social finances. We don't farm child molesters, who actively harm one of the most vulnerable demographics. And this has nothing to do with moral consideration to begin with. A cow will not run you down to kill and eat you. A cow attacks when it has reason to. Same with chickens and same with pigs, yet we grant these animals no moral consideration. Yet we grant domestic animals these rights. Many people would hurt someone who harmed their pet. Why are those same people fine with funding the torture of other species of animals? Is that not by definition hypocrisy? And we can also postulate that animals do feel remorse. When puppies play too rough the puppy will squeak, and that lets the other puppy know to stop. We also do not torture and murder sociopaths just because they are incapable of feeling remorse for any actions. Killing an animal because it cant feel remorse would have to extend to humans as well who can not feel remorse.