Thoughts on Involuntary Celebates(incels)

You can only control what you can control. Lord knows I've had my relationship droughts just as many other guys on this site have had. I can somewhat empathize with what goes through an incels mind when it comes to dating and relationships. At the end of the day though, if you aren't taking some measure of steps to improve your life, you only have yourself to blame. Be it going to school/finding a new/better job, making somewhat of an effort to keep yourself in shape, finding new interests and hobbies. If you aren't doing at least some of those things, then you have no room to complain about your life imo. And more times than not, there are things incels could be doing to better themselves and they frankly choose not to and/or are too lazy to do it.

@judgementoftherain: I think you're trying to talk about MANY subjects at once and you're making a bit of a messy job. For starters, the title of your post may be about InCels, but your post is mainly a rant about MGTOW. And you also put MGTOW, PUAs, MRAs, Red-Pillers and the entire Manosphere into one basket. I agree with most things that you say about double standards but I refuse to choose a side in this 'Gender War', because both sides have legitimate arguments and both sides have extremists who hate the other side. From what I've read and watched online these past 5 years: MRAs are the ones who gave birth to the Manosphere and the Red Pill. They're simply Men's Rights Activists who want laws to be more fair to men when it comes to reproductive rights, the family court etc. Their fight is a legal one. They do have some extremists/misogynists in their ranks who are usually weeded out by the females in the MRA ranks (yes, they have many female supporters). PUAs (PickUp Artists) only care about having sex with as many women as possible. They place their entire worth as humans in their ability to seduce women. Extremely shallow and manipulative individuals. While some of them do offer useful advice on how to approach and socialize with women, most simply write books to make money out of InCels... MGTOW consider PUAs an enemy. MGTOW are basically Individualists. They remove themselves from the dating game because they see it as rigged against men right from the beginning. And that's because modern Society is extremely Gynocentric and Female Hypergamy is out of control, as they say. A fact which causes 80% of women to pursue the top 20% of men, which gives rise to harems for that top 20% and Involuntary Celibacy for the bottom 80%. MGTOW men instead choose to focus on themselves. Their self-improvement in all fields of life. Their journey is an inward one. Education, career, hobbies, traveling, creativity, philosophy, spirituality. They don't really care about getting married or having kids. They live for themselves. "No Society and no woman will determine my worth as a man and as a human being. I will determine my own worth. Only I can give true validation to myself." These are POWERFUL words and this is a noble goal indeed. However, many MGTOW men fall into the misogyny/extremism trap as well. And the ones who do, are usually former InCels... Which brings us to: InCels. (Involuntary Celibates) Mostly male but many female ones exist as well (~20% of the female population). As they grow older, most InCels tend to also be unemployed and anti-social, because their condition causes them to lose all motivation for life in general. Contrary to popular belief, research has shown that MORE THAN HALF of them are NOT ugly or fat! The reasons for being InCels are their ridiculously high standards in women as well as their lack of social skill. They're basically as Hypergamous as women are. And they pay the price by remaining single, waiting for that fairytale Princess... The European equivalent is called NEET (Not in Education, Employment or Training) and the Japanese equivalents are the Herbivore men and the Hikikomori. Most InCels live their lives in solitude and silence. They're mostly apathetic to life and they never hurt a fly. Some rare, extreme cases however, either turn suicidal due to their bitterness and misery, or homicidal like Elliot Rodger. Being an InCel is a stage that ALMOST ALL men go through at some points during their life. And it's perfectly NORMAL. It is the woman that chooses. Sex is not easy for a man, unless he belongs in that top 20%. This effectively makes most men InCels, as they cannot have sex whenever they desire and with whomever they desire. Are all these men 'defective'? No. Of course not. As a matter of fact, studies show that young men no longer try anymore: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY9TVpgqf_I Virgin men in particular have been shown to be more romantic, affectionate, innocent-minded, well-intentioned and pure-hearted. Which, ironically enough, would make them perfect husbands and fathers... The problem with modern society is that it generalizes. They take the MOST EXTREME cases of ALL these categories of men, and they call them sexists, misogynists etc. And this blame and shame only makes the problem worse, because it radicalizes such men even MORE! So, Society creates these men, and then it tells them that it's THEIR fault for being broken. In short, every society has the problems it deserves: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CR-1HiAsdjE PUAs prey financially on InCels. InCels must not give their money to PUAs. Instead, they should listen to the MGTOW philosophy and follow their example. Unfortunately, some MGTOW men shame InCels too, and that's extremely bad because they leave them with no other place to go to... Turd Flinging Monkey is a case of an extremist MGTOW man who shames InCels and calls for taking women's rights away. While he supports everything he says with evidence, he fails to realize that if we take women's rights away and essentialy make them PROPERTY, then WE will be responsible for the lives of women... Do you really want to be responsible for the life of somebody else? I don't! And then of course we have the Radical Feminists and their Misandrist agenda. Masters of the Blame and Shame game. They'll blame men for everything under the sun and shame them for being single. As if a man can simply decide to not be single just like that! It's easy to shame someone who has no options and no control whatsoever over something. But it's also pointless. And that's why it means nothing... When confronted with such Feminist extremists, just ignore them and leave. You CANNOT win. They will NOT listen to logical arguments or evidence presented and they only respond with Ad Hominems (feelings). "Who hurt you?" "No wonder you're single with that attitude" ZERO arguments presented. Only spontaneous conclusions about your character when they don't even know you. Personally, I've been an InCel during most of my 20s. That changed when I reached my 30s and I had something to show for myself. You see, women get their Sexual Marketplace Value frontloaded when they reach 18 and pretty much EVERY man alive wants to have sex with them... But for men, it's the exact OPPOSITE. They begin at ZERO and they have to EARN their Sexual Marketplace Value as they grow older. And they do that by focusing in THEMSELVES. The MGTOW way. It was amazing how girls suddenly seemed to notice me when I was simply focusing in the things that I'm passionate about instead of chasing women. When a man chases women, he looks desperate and he WASTES all his time, energy and money. And what does he achieve in the end? Nothing! Now imagine a man INVESTING his youth, his time, energy and money in HIMSELF. Education, career, fitness, interests... Now THAT makes a man interesting and successful! And it's exactly THAT which attracts women. In November this year, I'll be 40 YEARS OLD. And I still look 28-32. I've had a wonderful relationship with a girl who was 15 years younger than me, which lasted for 5 1/2 years. I've had a threesome, I've been in a polyamorous relationship with 2 women, I've tried DDlg etc. etc. HOW do you think that I achieved all that? By bitching about double standards and injustices? By wasting my money on PUA books? By wasting my time on chasing women? No! I did it by BUILDING myself. Even as I write this, I have two 17 year old girls telling me how much attracted to me they feel. One of them, I met in here, and I've only been in here for less than a week. The other, I met in a Facebook group about anime, and she says that I'm older than her father, and yet whenever she speaks to me, she feels like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoVVKPePL-M Whether you're male or female, please repeat after me: "I refuse to take part in the Gender War! I refuse to shame others and perpetuate the negativity. I'll instead focus on myself and be POSITIVE to other people". Thank you for your time! I love you all! ^_^

Of course. A lot of political shouting matches aren't worth it. And the only person responsible for your happiness is you.

Beyonder: Amen to that Also things need to be put in categories, but at the same time nobody can be labeled. Technically an incel isn't a bad person per se, but in general on the internet, incel are terrible because we assume it's the worst kind right off the bat.