[Serious] Genderfluid/Non-binary/Queers

The traditional male/female idea is outdated. This isn't about people's physical bodies. This is about how they FEEL. Could you imagine being forced to live as the opposite gender? Think of all those society norms you'd have to conform to. These new terms aren't necessarily coming along because people want to be 'special'. They're here because more than ever, we are THINKING. We think about who we are. Back in the past, nobody really did that. They just accepted their place in the world. But now, people are discovering things about themselves nobody before them ever considered. And like everyone else, they want to feel like they belong. So they create groups to find others like them. And those groups get bigger. That's why there's so many 'categories' now.

I don't believe there's anything wrong with the idea of gender dysphoria. But, humanity is governed by a binary sex system, and thus it makes sense that there are two genders. There doesn't need to be more. Sure, people are born in the wrong body, but going between them or blatantly refusing to identify as one or the other is pretty bullshit. I'm gonna call it that because at the end of the day, asking someone to refer to you gender neutrally is presumptive and rude. Also, I know several psychiatrists - they all agree that trans is a real and recognizable phenomenon, but they agree to three basic points about the genderfluid movement: * Suspecting that the more extreme ends of the gender-expression camp are primarily motivated by fashion or attention-seeking, rather than any sort of dysphoria; that they may be exaggerating normal variations in gender expression, and turning them into totemic "personality traits", in the hope that it'll make them seem trendy and interesting. * Feeling that genderqueer people shouldn't try to borrow the language, culture or perceived oppression of the trans-rights movement, and that when they do attempt to borrow these things, they're seriously undercutting the movement for no good reason other than attention-seeking. * In general, believing that genderqueer people do not warrant the same care, attention and accommodations that trans people do; in particular, believing that expecting people to use exotic neopronouns is rude, presumptive nonsense. To clarify, if someone is an effeminate guy or a butch girl - that's totally normal. But declaring you're too good for genders is standoffish and entitled.

I have another solution entirely. Yes, there is the binary system in place, male and female, but I think trans is the third option, or rather, fourth (m to f and f to m). I think people can be allowed to have reasonable doubts and question where they are, but its like a transition so to speak. I think a person should be allowed to figure things out and make a choice, but too much can have you end up like Mr. Garrison on South Park. I don't oppose people trying things out with identity, but don't expect the whole world to accommodate you on yours whims. There are people struggling for their whole lives who need support, but I don't take things teenagers say seriously at all. People do change in all things, including identity. It's just allowing people to express themselves. But eventually, people will find their place on the spectrum- any other scenario after a given time expresses mental concerns to be addressed.

Alright, trans "special snowflake" here. Non-binary "3rd genders" have existed for thousands of years prior, they are not some new trend of sorts. I fail to see where you are coming from in your argument- what do you have against non-binary people? As far as I know, they've never disputed your gender identity, so why are you so resentful towards theirs?

Hijira and third genders in Asia are a totally different kettle of fish from what you're pushing. Number one, all of these are pretty much euphemisms or variations of trans people. If you distill that down, you're still either male or female. I'm not against trans people. I'm against people trying to dilute the concept of genders and the gender binary, which is based on biological fact that most animals generally fall into one of two categories. Yes, there are intersex people, but unless you karyotype your DNA or have the genitalia to prove that you fall in that category, there is not excuse. If you're a boy or girl - fine, if you're trans and are working towards becoming the opposite gender - also fine. But you cant just park in the middle and expect to idle there forever. How do you expect the medical industry to conform to that, for example - if you're a woman, you see a gynaecologist, if you're a man, you see an andrologist. Medicines are calibrated for the hormonal and bodily differences of men and women - which is why trans people take the opposite hormones, not only so that they can enjoy the secondary sex characteristics they identify with, but for reasons such as those, if you go to a doctor with strep, and you're female, the dosage he gives you will be about 75% of what a male of the same weight would receive. You can't stay in the middle. If you want to be a guy - fine, get the T injections and move on. If you want to be a girl, fine, get the oestrogen and drive on - I have an issue with inaction, and for nonbinary people to constantly request bullshit from a society which is not intended to be used and abused in such a manner, "they" is a plural term. You will get he or she from me, so pick your poison because English only has one gender neutral term and that is "it" and a lot of people hate use of "it" in this context. To ask that we enable you to have the endless manufactured terms that pop up on SJW sites daily is just asinine. The fact is, day in day out we live in a world where someone's movements has negative repercussions for someone. And I think any perceived benefits proposed by NB SJW are not outweighed by the negatives.

I get where you're coming from in the medical terms in sorts- but not when it comes to women seeing gynecologists and men seeing andrologists. Not all women have vaginas, and not all men have penises. There are men with vaginas, and women with penises, and people in between or without a gender that have one or the other. Instead of this dose for men, and that does for women, it is pretty easy to switch around and say "people with penises take this dose, and people with vaginas take this dose" without too much trouble. Alright, what if you don't know a person's gender? Do you just go flying in with he or she? Here's a definition of the word "they". I suggest you look at the second definition. they T͟Hā/Submit pronoun pronoun: they 1. used to refer to two or more people or things previously mentioned or easily identified. "the two men could get life sentences if they are convicted" people in general. "the rest, as they say, is history" informal a group of people in authority regarded collectively. "they cut my water off" 2. used to refer to a person of unspecified sex. Also, you really didn't tell me what negative repercussions non-binary genders have towards you. There's really no reason to get all up and upset about an issue that does not affect you in any way, shape, or form.

> Men with vaginas and women with penises I neglected to mention that I fully support making it a requirement for legal sex changes to include sexual reassignment surgery - maybe not right away, but require a pledge that "Yes, I will seek surgical treatment within X number of years unless I obtain a medical waiver denoting exemption" the latter would be designed for those who have contraindications for surgery. So that being said, I see both of those conditions outlined above as purely transient situations. And you're missing the point because there's the fact that trans women and trans men have hormonal and physical similarities more towards their target gender, so its not so easy to say "people with penises and people w/ vaginas take this" This also ties into that someone wanting to change their legal sex should both be taking hormones and presenting as the opposite gender, the latter waivable on a case by case basis. Again, I do not subscribe to the dilution of "they" as a singular pronoun. This is not universally accepted, and I stand behind the side that says no, its unacceptable manipulation of the English language. Other languages have a slightly different situation, like Mandarin, where third person pronouns only differ in how they're written, IE he/she is always tā, where as they is always tāmen. In the singular case, they are written differently. At the end of the day, I wouldn't have as much of an issue if it was confined to the personal domain and not used to garner attention or try to make society revolve around such a small minority.

That's right, men with vaginas and women with penises. People's parts do not determine their gender. I fully disagree with your statement about being required to have legal sex changes. I consider myself a boy, and i'm happy with my body- I don't wish to transition. I take it you are cis? Why do you want to have control like that over trans people's bodies? How is their choice in body affecting you? Maybe I should restate what I said in terms of medical treatments- people can easily tell the doctors that they are trans, and the doctors can readjust the doses. The english language is everchanging and evolving. Your reasoning is extremely old fashioned. Words change meaning (the word wonderful used to mean the exact opposite as it does today, do you use the old definition?) and new words are added on a frequent basis. We're not looking to have society revolve around us- we simply want respect for our genders and our pronouns. Which, as your proving now, is extremely hard to get, which is why we need to keep fighting for our rights.